During my journey down the rabbit hole to discover the truth (which I now understand to be Jesus Christ) I was influenced heavily—in a good way—by two individuals.
If you’re reading this, you probably have read the works of “The One Who Is Watching”, who was my first good influence; but another is an anonymous poster who floats around, leaving comments on nearly all of the alternative Mormon blogs.
Over the years she’s gone by the username’s of “Anon23” and “Lilli” and “BK” and “DeeLynn.” Although she uses different names, it’s easy to spot her comments. There is a distinct spirit that follows her.
I’ve watched her—over these years—lose faith in the word of God.
Here’s how she understood the truth in 2013:
As the Book of Mormon prophets who saw our day foretold, everyone in the Church has been deceived by false prophets who preach & practice false doctrines & whoredoms since Joseph died. We must awake to our awful situation in the Church and realize we are in the same situation Alma found himself in in his corrupt Church.
Soon Christ & Joseph will return to earth to restore the true Church to the earth. We must live according to the holy scriptures until then and not listen to the contrary doctrine of so-called prophets today.
For Joseph warned that those who are deceived by falsehoods & false prophets will lose their exaltation & standing in the Celestial Kingdom. And he said most people fall for these false prophets, thinking them to be true ones, because they don’t test them & their doctrines to see if they are preaching contrary to Christ & the scriptures that Joseph gave us, that would be the BoM & the original D&C (1835 edition)
This is phenomenal. Her viewpoints ALMOST align with that of Watcher or I. However, she would want no association with Watcher. Here’s a comment she left on his site…
Again this is from 2013:
I agree that the Church is in a deep apostasy since Joseph Smith and the leaders today have no authority anymore than any other church on earth does.
You seem to understand, and have stated, that prophets can’t teach contrary revelation to what has already been given and that which is in the scriptures or contrary to Christ’s teachings, yet you don’t seem to believe that Joseph understood or lived by his own teachings of this.
Joseph taught that those who do preach or practice contrary to the scriptures are ‘imposters’, false teachers, even false prophets who should be shunned and not listened to. So if Joseph did such, taught false doctrine, then he was also a false or fallen prophet, especially if he preached or practiced such serious abominations as polygamy, which I don’t believe he did.
I believe in the pure testimony of Joseph Smith, despite all the rumors and hearsay against him, usually by evil or easily deceived people. Why do I believe him and not them? Because of his fruits and the way he lived and the Gospel he taught and the way he treated and loved Emma. If you know what true love looks like you can see if other’s have it or not. I believe he possessed true love for Emma and thus would not have ever done such vile and abusive things to her and his children or other women.
But you apparently believe he did and thus fell from his high station as Prophet. For if you think Joseph remained a true prophet after abusing Emma in some of the worse of ways and committing adultery on her repeatedly, then with such ‘true’ prophets you don’t need ‘false’ ones. For if Joseph lied and really did such things, no false prophet was worse than he was, Yet you seem to want to give him a pass and still maintain he was a true prophet, just with some faults and brush off how awful the things he supposedly did were.
If you believe true prophets can commit atrocious abuse and adultery and still remain true prophets and maintain their power and authority and expect anyone through all time to give them a second’s notice, then I don’t know what to say to that, it’s utterly appalling to me. Why would I ever listen to or put trust in a man who is so evil? How could I believe in such a God who would expect such a thing or have such men as Prophets or leaders?
You do not seem to understand how God expects men and especially true prophets to treat women, especially their wives, and the eternal consequences for them if they don’t live up to his standards.
If Joseph fell and did such vile things as you believe he did, then he was one of the worst false or fallen prophets that ever lived, just as Brigham Young was and all those leaders who followed after him were.
If you don’t believe polygamy was a true principle, then I don’t understand why you would have any trust or faith in anything Brigham Young put out after Joseph died, like D&C 110. That would be like accepting scripture from Warren Jeffs and him saying it was from Joseph. Do you not realize that BY could and would have easily doctored that journal and made up that story about the angels to further his own agenda, to look like he had keys?
D&C 110 may or may not be true, but from what I see it appears to come from such a shaky foundation that we would be foolish to put any stock in it, let alone build our beliefs around it. We can’t automatically trust anything that BY put out after Joseph died. Yes, BY did teach true things, but they were so mixed in with falsehoods that it is impossible to discern his truth from error unless one has the Holy Spirit as their guide and Charity.
I would sooner believe that Oliver C. was in error than Joseph. For I believe Joseph proved to have true love for Emma, (which is a vital requirement of a true prophet) despite what all the story books say and the mounds of hearsay against him, which should totally be expected if he was a true prophet, for all hell would break loose trying to discredit him and make him look bad.
You appear to believe Joseph was one of the worst of men, an extremely abusive adulterous liar who was completely past feeling. Such men do not repent in this life, except by a miracle.
Do you realize that one day you will have to stand before Joseph and explain to him why you refused to believe him and his humble testimony, and instead chose to believe the vilest of hearsay against him, usually from those who did the vilest of evils, which he gave his life fighting against?
If Joseph really fell for such whoredoms, I believe he is standing in Spirit Prison now and would consider anyone foolish to trust anything he ever published or taught.
God especially would not expect or want anyone to listen to anyone who would do such things. Prophets have to prove their are of such high standing and near perfect and have true Christlike Charity, especially for their wife or they can’t expect anyone to listen to them.
Yes, Joseph was not perfect, but he was close. Being deceived to put evil men into high callings or fall for false revelation for a short time is not near the level of the atrocity of committing whoredoms. Even true followers of Christ are deceived at times, but they soon catch themselves because they have the Spirit to warn them that something is not right and they need to look further into things or the Spirit teaches them how they were wrong. But true followers of Christ, true prophets don’t fall for whoredoms or abuse wives or women, and if they do they aren’t true prophets anymore. Many true prophets throughout history have fallen and become fallen prophets and lost their exaltation.
But I believe Joseph was too wise and to good to fall for polygamy, or even an angel who might come demanding it, he would have known instantly that it was a bad angel preaching whoredoms that were completely contrary to God’s laws. He would have not given a moment’s notice to such an angel.
Could he have fallen for polygamy anyway, because of the weakness of the flesh? Certainly, but I see no proof whatsoever that he weakened and fell, he proved himself over and over to be strong enough to give the greatest of sacrifices and wise enough to teach the greatest of doctrines, which a fallen man would not have been strong or wise enough to do.
One last thing, Christ clearly taught that it takes true unconditional love, especially for one’s spouse, to be or discern true prophets, let alone discern right from wrong, true scripture from false scripture and devils from saints.
Without such charity, we are nothing and have no power, promise or ability to discern, and we will always and easily be deceived by false prophets and false doctrines and false revelation, thinking them to be true and thinking ourselves to be right and righteous.
Before we ever seek to discern truth from error in church history or in the scriptures or in those around us, we must make sure we possess this charity, this Christlike true love, especially for our spouse. It has always been very rare to find anyone throughout the history of the world who possesses such love, even prophets usually don’t possess it as needed and that is why many of them have fallen and been so easily deceived by devils.
Are you fireproof? Do you have true love for your wife? Do you live to love and serve her every wish before you own, all day long? Perhaps you do. I certainly commend you if you do.
But if we don’t possess such everlasting unconditional love, (most LDS don’t even ‘believe’ in it anymore today), then we can’t trust ourselves to see or discern correctly yet or be able to judge true prophets from false ones. For it takes a true prophet to know a true prophet. Those who posses true charity, true love, are prophets, it’s that hard and rare to possess.
Excuse the length of that excerpt, but I truly believe the above comment is worth the read. If you read the whole thing, thank you. I want you to see the light and clarity she had.
However, she believed that Joseph Smith was innocent of polygamy.
That’s the only difference I had with her. Now… there are many differences.
Here’s a comment she wrote in 2016:
I agree that those who don’t keep Christ’s commandments are in apostasy, and thus that would include the leaders of the Church, past & present, including Joseph Smith, even if, as evidence suggests, that he was innocent of polygamy and only had 1 wife, Emma.
But we must remember that the so called ‘words of Christ’ were written down by very fallible men, many years after Christ had come and gone, and probably weren’t even written by his Apostles. And when we see that even some of Christ’s words contradict each other it even further suggests that the ‘words of Christ’ were tampered with, so as to put them all in doubt.
Lilli, the above poster, has lost all faith in the Restoration movement, and even doubts the words said by Christ in the gospels.
She used to be at an advanced understanding of Mormonism–
So what caused her loss of faith? It was because she believed Joseph Smith was innocent of polygamy. Even though she now believes the Book of Mormon to be false, she still–somewhat–clings to the belief that Joseph was innocent.
The Saints MUST find Joseph guilty. That’s the only way to understand the awful situation we’re in. Nothing will come together unless you understand the atonement offering of Joseph & others as outlined in Leviticus 16.
Watcher, Searcher, and I have gone to great lengths to explain the bizarre behavior of Joseph Smith. All three of us have had little impact as far as I am aware, yet our message is PARAMOUNT.
Without it, you will ultimately lose faith in the foundational claims of the Mormon movement.
You may be able to retain faith in Christ, but you will never understand the scriptures.
If you haven’t noticed, lately blogging hasn’t been a high priority for me. Things I discover in the scriptures I feel like keeping to myself, and I’m tired of debunking Denver. He posted something literally today that I could write an entire post on…but I won’t. I’m going to get out and enjoy the sun and experience my final years in Babylon.
If you need to reach me my email is theworkofthefather37 @ gmail.com
Always happy to talk,